usagi_tetsu
03-01-2005, 05:41 PM
I had posted a question over on PBN around January 2005 concerning valves, and thought I'd bring it over here to share.
First off, the poll:
Maddman Rocket - 9 votes
MacDev Red - 3 votes
AirSoldier Trade-In High Flow - 1 vote
Other - 1 vote
The Posts, with PBN usernames:
usagi_tetsu
Okay eveyone, Maddman Rocket, MacDev Red, AirSoldier Valve Trade-In, or something else? What do you guys like and why do you like it? Please, facts and figures if you got 'em.
MickyD
Is the AKA Tornado Valve compatible with Tribals?
shiftycastro30
Originally posted by Kansas Kaos
Rocket. Equal or better flow than the rest.... plus no pesky valve spring in front of the cup seal.
And can you even get a red valve anymore?? (end quote)
no valve spring ........always a plus
got to go with the rocket
as far as the red valve .....tracker has quite a few
kytracker212
I voted for the Red Valve. First: I like to change the valve spring (sometimes to a lighter spring, help’s with FPS sometimes). Second: Easy to add the valve buffer. Third: No Exhaust valve o-ring. Plus as shiftycastro30 said I still have a few new ones, plus some Air Soldier & rocket valves in my parts boxes. LOL
usagi_tetsu
Originally posted by MickyD
Is the AKA Tornado Valve compatible with Tribals? (end quote)
That brings up another question: are all autococker valves Tribal compatible?
warpedmephisto
I would have to say no on that one. The cocker valves are quite a bit smaller in OD than Tribal valves. The only thing that I think will work is Bushy and EM1 valves, but don't hold me to that. Really, I don't have all that much of a problem with the stock valve. I find that if you tune a marker right, you can be plenty fine in consistency and efficiency with the stock valve. But my runner up would have to be Red Valve then closely followed by the Rocket valve. I just like having adjustable spring tension on the cup seal. Thats the tinkerer coming out in me though.
vanquish_v12
yeah, cocker valves are definately too small. hmmmm.....I just got a Vapor valve for my Bushy, so my stock valve is just sitting on my desk next to my keyboard....
edit: well I just tried it, the Bushy valve is like half a millimeter too wide to fit in the Tribal. They're the same length and everything, its just too wide.
Kansas Kaos
According to Michael Marr's info (Maddman Products) the Tribal, EM1, Bk2 & Defiant are all the same...... at least when it comes to the Rocket valve.
*** Also on a side note, you can change springs on the Rocket valve too. During the proto period the valve only came with one spring. I personally experimented with all kinds of other spring options with some success. Later during regular production 2 springs were included with each valve, one firm, one soft. Keep in mind the Rocket also allows you to tweek the valve stem length, that controls the distance the cup seal "cone" extends from the valve body. I don't believe any other valve has that option.
warpedmephisto
True, no other valve has that option, but you could always vary the length of the valve pin or the thickness of your dampner. I still think the Rocket is a great valve, but just not absolutely necessary.
joez
My vote goes to the Rocket valve.
vanquish_v12
yeah I just tried my Bushy valve again and its definately not gonna fit. maybe the diameter of the stock bushy valve is a touch wider than aftermarket Bushy valves because it only has one o-ring as opposed to two o-rings? From just looking at the Bushy and Tribal valves they look to be the same size, its just a very very small difference.
Kansas Kaos
Yeah the 1 versus 2 o-ring design could very well be the difference. It's also possible that that 1 o-ring is "thicker"..? What if you took the o-ring off and streched a slightly smaller one on?? Not a big deal, just wondering............
vanquish_v12
nope, I'm putting the valve in so that the end without the o-ring is going in first, so the o-ring isnt the part thats getting in the way. Next time I take my Vapor valve out of my Bushy I'll try it in a Tribal and see if that fits any better.
usagi_tetsu
Well, if we can use Bushy valves in our Tribals, than we still have a large market for valves. AKA, MacDev, Check It, Zenitram, and Vaporworks all make Bushy valves currently (as well as ICD, duh), so I think we've got some options out there. That is, of course, if the Bushy valves work in Tribals, or we can get a set of o-rings that'll make 'em work. Anyone got some Bushy valves and Tribal bodies to test it out on?
bullschmidt2k3
I don't think they'll work unless you modified the valve.
I have a red valve, and it's nice so I'm voting for it. Rocket valves are sweet, but not all that is necessary
smegle5
i vote for the red cuz my new triby has one and um well its red, what else do i have to say?
and yes i am back, woo!
TheTramp
I'd just get your stock worked on/traded in with HaveBlue. The Rocket is great for tinkering but personaly as far as the valve goes I like "plug and play."
Have Blue
The Rocket is the only Bushy valve that I know of that will work in the Tribal - Mike simply made the OD small enough that it would work in both guns.
There is another possibility for Tribal valves, but only if kytracker gives the prototype the thumbs-up
*cpt*seawolf
glad to see u still post a bit Mike
warpedmephisto
Blue - I like the sounds of that.
usagi_tetsu
Blue! Good to see you around bud, though I can definitely understand your absence as you and Punisher are doing some great things over at Air Soldier. I've been saving my pennies up for your M98 pump conversion kit, just because it'd be a conversation piece and a pump gun option in the collection.
Anyway, back to topic, valve project? Is this something uber-secret like the 2-Liter, or can you give us some specifics now to wet our whistles?
bullschmidt2k3
Originally posted by Have Blue
There is another possibility for Tribal valves, but only if kytracker gives the prototype the thumbs-up(end quote)
does this happen to be that big secret project?
Have Blue
It's not _that_ exciting - just shaving down a popular Bushy valve to fit the Tribal. We'll see what Chuck thinks - if he says they suck, then I won't do them.
Figured I'd try to fill the gap while Mike @ Maddmann is out of rockets...
(no, this is not 'that big secret project' - that's something else entirely, for someone else entirely)
bullschmidt2k3
dang...
And that's it. Thank god it was as small a discussion as it was, even using copy/paste, it was a pain in the backside doing it. Enjoy!
First off, the poll:
Maddman Rocket - 9 votes
MacDev Red - 3 votes
AirSoldier Trade-In High Flow - 1 vote
Other - 1 vote
The Posts, with PBN usernames:
usagi_tetsu
Okay eveyone, Maddman Rocket, MacDev Red, AirSoldier Valve Trade-In, or something else? What do you guys like and why do you like it? Please, facts and figures if you got 'em.
MickyD
Is the AKA Tornado Valve compatible with Tribals?
shiftycastro30
Originally posted by Kansas Kaos
Rocket. Equal or better flow than the rest.... plus no pesky valve spring in front of the cup seal.
And can you even get a red valve anymore?? (end quote)
no valve spring ........always a plus
got to go with the rocket
as far as the red valve .....tracker has quite a few
kytracker212
I voted for the Red Valve. First: I like to change the valve spring (sometimes to a lighter spring, help’s with FPS sometimes). Second: Easy to add the valve buffer. Third: No Exhaust valve o-ring. Plus as shiftycastro30 said I still have a few new ones, plus some Air Soldier & rocket valves in my parts boxes. LOL
usagi_tetsu
Originally posted by MickyD
Is the AKA Tornado Valve compatible with Tribals? (end quote)
That brings up another question: are all autococker valves Tribal compatible?
warpedmephisto
I would have to say no on that one. The cocker valves are quite a bit smaller in OD than Tribal valves. The only thing that I think will work is Bushy and EM1 valves, but don't hold me to that. Really, I don't have all that much of a problem with the stock valve. I find that if you tune a marker right, you can be plenty fine in consistency and efficiency with the stock valve. But my runner up would have to be Red Valve then closely followed by the Rocket valve. I just like having adjustable spring tension on the cup seal. Thats the tinkerer coming out in me though.
vanquish_v12
yeah, cocker valves are definately too small. hmmmm.....I just got a Vapor valve for my Bushy, so my stock valve is just sitting on my desk next to my keyboard....
edit: well I just tried it, the Bushy valve is like half a millimeter too wide to fit in the Tribal. They're the same length and everything, its just too wide.
Kansas Kaos
According to Michael Marr's info (Maddman Products) the Tribal, EM1, Bk2 & Defiant are all the same...... at least when it comes to the Rocket valve.
*** Also on a side note, you can change springs on the Rocket valve too. During the proto period the valve only came with one spring. I personally experimented with all kinds of other spring options with some success. Later during regular production 2 springs were included with each valve, one firm, one soft. Keep in mind the Rocket also allows you to tweek the valve stem length, that controls the distance the cup seal "cone" extends from the valve body. I don't believe any other valve has that option.
warpedmephisto
True, no other valve has that option, but you could always vary the length of the valve pin or the thickness of your dampner. I still think the Rocket is a great valve, but just not absolutely necessary.
joez
My vote goes to the Rocket valve.
vanquish_v12
yeah I just tried my Bushy valve again and its definately not gonna fit. maybe the diameter of the stock bushy valve is a touch wider than aftermarket Bushy valves because it only has one o-ring as opposed to two o-rings? From just looking at the Bushy and Tribal valves they look to be the same size, its just a very very small difference.
Kansas Kaos
Yeah the 1 versus 2 o-ring design could very well be the difference. It's also possible that that 1 o-ring is "thicker"..? What if you took the o-ring off and streched a slightly smaller one on?? Not a big deal, just wondering............
vanquish_v12
nope, I'm putting the valve in so that the end without the o-ring is going in first, so the o-ring isnt the part thats getting in the way. Next time I take my Vapor valve out of my Bushy I'll try it in a Tribal and see if that fits any better.
usagi_tetsu
Well, if we can use Bushy valves in our Tribals, than we still have a large market for valves. AKA, MacDev, Check It, Zenitram, and Vaporworks all make Bushy valves currently (as well as ICD, duh), so I think we've got some options out there. That is, of course, if the Bushy valves work in Tribals, or we can get a set of o-rings that'll make 'em work. Anyone got some Bushy valves and Tribal bodies to test it out on?
bullschmidt2k3
I don't think they'll work unless you modified the valve.
I have a red valve, and it's nice so I'm voting for it. Rocket valves are sweet, but not all that is necessary
smegle5
i vote for the red cuz my new triby has one and um well its red, what else do i have to say?
and yes i am back, woo!
TheTramp
I'd just get your stock worked on/traded in with HaveBlue. The Rocket is great for tinkering but personaly as far as the valve goes I like "plug and play."
Have Blue
The Rocket is the only Bushy valve that I know of that will work in the Tribal - Mike simply made the OD small enough that it would work in both guns.
There is another possibility for Tribal valves, but only if kytracker gives the prototype the thumbs-up
*cpt*seawolf
glad to see u still post a bit Mike
warpedmephisto
Blue - I like the sounds of that.
usagi_tetsu
Blue! Good to see you around bud, though I can definitely understand your absence as you and Punisher are doing some great things over at Air Soldier. I've been saving my pennies up for your M98 pump conversion kit, just because it'd be a conversation piece and a pump gun option in the collection.
Anyway, back to topic, valve project? Is this something uber-secret like the 2-Liter, or can you give us some specifics now to wet our whistles?
bullschmidt2k3
Originally posted by Have Blue
There is another possibility for Tribal valves, but only if kytracker gives the prototype the thumbs-up(end quote)
does this happen to be that big secret project?
Have Blue
It's not _that_ exciting - just shaving down a popular Bushy valve to fit the Tribal. We'll see what Chuck thinks - if he says they suck, then I won't do them.
Figured I'd try to fill the gap while Mike @ Maddmann is out of rockets...
(no, this is not 'that big secret project' - that's something else entirely, for someone else entirely)
bullschmidt2k3
dang...
And that's it. Thank god it was as small a discussion as it was, even using copy/paste, it was a pain in the backside doing it. Enjoy!